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Currency Wars

Currency Wars (simplified Chinese: 货币战争; traditional Chinese: 貨幣戰爭; pinyin: Huòbì zhànzhēng) by Song Hongbing, also known as The Currency War, is a bestseller in China, reportedly selling over 200,000 copies in addition to an estimated 400,000 unlicensed copies in circulation and is reportedly being read by many senior level government and business leaders in China. Originally published in 2007 the book gained a resurgence in 2009 and is seen as a prominent exponent of a recently emerged genre labeled “economic nationalist” literature.

The premise of this book is that Western countries are ultimately controlled by a group of private banks, which, according to the book, runs their central banks.

According to the book, the western countries in general and the US in particular are controlled by a clique of international bankers, which use currency manipulation (hence the title) to gain wealth by first loaning money in USD to developing nations and then shorting their currency. The Japanese Lost decade, the 1997 Asian Financial Crisis, the Latin American financial crisis and others are attributed to this cause.

Song also is of the opinion that the famous U.S. central bank, the Federal Reserve, is not a department of state functions, but several private banks operated by the private sector, and that these private banks are loyal to the ubiquitous Rothschild family.

The book looks back at history and argues that fiat currency itself is a conspiracy; it sees in the abolition of representative currency and the installment of fiat currency a struggle between the “banking clique” and the governments of the western nations, ending in the victory of the former. It advises the Chinese government to keep a vigilant eye on China’s currency and instate a representative currency.


The book has achieved bestseller status in China. Although acknowledging the book’s huge popularity in China, the Financial Times described it as only passably entertaining and its thesis as far-fetched. Fred Hu, managing director of Goldman Sachs Group, said the currency wars were “non-existent”. He uses in his review words as “a simple out of line, outrageous distortion”, “many errors, out of context, far-fetched, exaggerated, or simply speculate, uncertain”, and the conclusion to this book as a “melted mixed the ultra-left trend of thought, far-right tendencies, populism, isolationism, anarchism”.

The book has been criticized for promoting antisemitic conspiracy theories. The book says that Jews have been conspiring to covertly influence historical events ranging from the Battle of Waterloo to the assassination of John F. Kennedy, with the intention of increasing their wealth and influence. In this respect, the material echoes traditional antisemitic conspiracy theories such as The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion, The International Jew, and Nazi propaganda like Der Stürmer. This is seen as rather unusual as China is not generally known for antisemitism.

https://infogalactic.com/info/Currency_Wars

The Triffin dilemma or paradox is the conflict of economic interests that arises between short-term domestic and long-term international objectives for countries whose currencies serve as global reserve currencies. This dilemma was first identified in the 1960s by Belgian-American economist Robert Triffin, who pointed out that the country whose currency, being the global reserve currency, foreign nations wish to hold, must be willing to supply the world with an extra supply of its currency to fulfill world demand for these foreign exchange reserves, thus leading to a trade deficit.

The use of a national currency, such as the U.S. dollar, as global reserve currency leads to tension between its national and global monetary policy. This is reflected in fundamental imbalances in the balance of payments, specifically the current account, as some goals require an outflow of dollars from the United States, while others require an overall inflow.

Specifically, the Triffin dilemma is usually cited to articulate the problems with the role of the U.S. dollar as the reserve currency under the Bretton Woods system. John Maynard Keynes had anticipated this difficulty and had advocated the use of a global reserve currency called ‘Bancor’. Currently the IMF’s SDRs are the closest thing to the proposed Bancor but they have not been adopted widely enough to replace the dollar as the global reserve currency.

In the wake of the financial crisis of 2007–2008, the governor of the People’s Bank of China explicitly named the reserve currency status of the US dollar as a contributing factor to global savings and investment imbalances that led to the crisis. As such the Triffin Dilemma is related to the Global Savings Glut hypothesis because the dollar’s reserve currency role exacerbates the U.S. current account deficit due to heightened demand for dollars.

https://infogalactic.com/info/Triffin_dilemma

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126 comments on “Currency Wars

  1. Pingback: Currency Wars | Hipster Racist

  2. indravaruna
    March 21, 2017

    The favorite to win the French presidential election is a former Rothschild banker.

    Liked by 1 person

    • indravaruna
      March 21, 2017

      Expanding on this, I noticed that everytime a French President starts gets bothersome for (((them))) he is replaced by Rothschild banker or a American poodle:

      – Charles De Gaulle suffered a coup in 1968 that was instigated by the Jew Daniel Cohn-Bendit (also a pedophile) and was replaced by a former Rothschild banker Georges Pompidou.

      – Jacques Chirac was replaced by some Jewisha-Hungarian rat after the Iraq Invasion fiasco.

      – Now Hollande is being replaced by another Rothschild puppet.

      Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 21, 2017

        I’m really leery of seeing a “Rothschild” behind everything. It’s just too easy to play Six Degrees of Kevin Bacon with a family as large and prominent as the Rothschilds. Certainly, the international financial system is like an octopus with a tentacle in everything. It’s true that Jews – and Jewish families like the Rothschilds – have played an oversized role in Western finance over since the 1800s.

        I think seeing a “Rothschild” or even a “Jew” is to miss the forest for the trees, frankly.

        Like

  3. bob saffron
    March 21, 2017

    I think Ron Paul’s platform, explicitly non-racist, was by far the most pro-white platform out there. Ending the Federal Reserve and returning the currency to a gold-backing would do more to de-fang the Jews than virtually any other measure. And none of it could be accused of anti-Semitism, gentile bankers and politicians being conspicuous beneficiaries as well.

    As long as fiat currency, fractional-reserve banking, and the Federal Reserve System prevail, I see it hard to imagine how whites are to throw off their yoke. In other words, I’m pessimistic. Economics as a discipline is bankrupt (macro-, totally, micro-, to a lesser, though still considerable, extent). Has been so for almost a century.

    It’s not only whites who’ll suffer great hardship when the paradigm changes. Japanese public debt is stratosferic, even though their money supply growth has been very modest for many, many years. Bridges to nowhere and that debt’s not going anywhere. Ditto the Chinese and their house of cards.

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    • Hipster Racist
      March 21, 2017

      “returning the currency to a gold-backing would do more to de-fang the Jews than virtually any other measure.””

      Seems unlikely since Jews are major holders of gold. Talk about jumping out of the frying pan into the fire.

      Liked by 1 person

      • bob saffron
        March 21, 2017

        Central banks own a good portion of the world’s gold. The rest, who knows? The point is that gold can’t be willed up out of thin air to be then lent at interest. Not only does this transfer purchasing power from the late-receivers to the early-receivers of this money, it also creates the boom-bust business cycle (pace Keynes and his “animal spirits”).

        The good thing is that eventually economics will right itself. The bad thing is that many will not survive the painful reformation. This is the greatest monetary experiment in world history, and history is littered with failed paper monies.

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      • Hipster Racist
        March 21, 2017

        “The point is that gold can’t be willed up out of thin air”

        Yet it’s still completely arbitrary. Yes, gold cannot be printed like fiat by the banks or the government. Yet gold can be hoarded – thus causing deflation. Any new gold source can cause hyper-inflation, like happened to Europe when the Spanish brought all the gold back from South America. Of course gold is perfectly compatible with usury – historically that is exactly how usury worked. You lent some gold, then hoarded a larger supply, then when no one could pay back the usury you took the property. In effect, it’s the same goddamn thing as what they do with fiat.

        ” Not only does this transfer purchasing power from the late-receivers to the early-receivers”

        Yet purchasing power is is “transferred” by various other means as well. If you make up a gold shaped problem, obviously gold is the solution. It’s a solution in search of a problem. Fine, hoard all the gold, people will just use silver. Hoard all the silver, people will use tally sticks or cigarettes or bottles of Tide or Coke (those are big in the ghetto.) Now there’s bitcoin.

        Goldbuggery is a fetish, just ask Silas Marner. There is simply no “natural” connection between the real economy of goods and services and the random distribution of a specific element in the ground and how fast it can be discovered and dug up.

        “The good thing is that eventually economics will right itself. The bad thing is that many will not survive the painful reformation. This is the greatest monetary experiment in world history, and history is littered with failed paper monies.”

        There were boom and bust cycles under gold standards as well, and boom and bust cycles are not necessarily related to monetary quantity anyway. Overproduction is an obvious example – look what happened to farmers when mechanization happened. All of a sudden the market is flooded with cheap grain, thus the price drops. Farmers go out of business.

        Gold is a big fat red herring and lolerbertarianism is a cult religion.

        BTW, Song’s suggestion is NOT a gold standard, it’s that the state should regulate currency as opposed to the private banks. The argument against democratic control of money was that the people would inflate the currency. OK, but private banks do the same damn thing.

        OK, so a gold standard. Now the supply of money is fixed – until someone discovers a big gold deposit – and boom, you have inflation, just like with fiat.

        Can any of this libertarian goldbuggery justify itself without relying on it’s own circular reasoning and axiomatic assumptions? Because inflation, deflation, monetary supply – sure, we understand all that. But that still doesn’t justify a gold standard at all.

        Liked by 1 person

      • Sam J.
        March 22, 2017

        I like you Bob don’t take this the wrong way but gold is a disaster. Our present banking system is a disaster also.

        Money supply should be expanded at the same rate the productive economy is expanding. There’s nothing wrong with fiat at all if it meets that definition.

        I personally think that Kilowatt-hours would make a great currency. As the productive economy expands the rate of electricity usage goes almost directly with it. I bet you could get a damn good fit in the curve of Kilowatt-hours per person and GNP per person.

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      • bob saffron
        March 22, 2017

        “Yet gold can be hoarded – thus causing deflation.”

        99.99% of all the gold ever mined in history is hoarded! An infinitesimal amount is destroyed or lost in industrial processes.

        If people feel – perhaps experiencing greater uncertainty – a need to accumulate cash or gold or whatever the money is, then prices of goods and services will go down in money terms in a perfectly benign way. Computer prices diminish ever year and yet people don’t refrain from purchasing. Costs of production go down as well as revenues, so there’s no need why profits need be affected.

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      • Hipster Racist
        March 22, 2017

        So why do we need a gold standard at all?

        It is perfectly legal to buy and sell gold. It is perfectly legal to buy and sell paper gold. It is perfectly legal to buy and sell gold futures and to short gold.

        A “gold standard” just means that people are TAXED IN GOLD. So much for liberty! In an actually free market, gold has competitors. Why is there only supposed to be one form of money in the first place? What about silver? Or platinum?

        Liked by 1 person

      • bob saffron
        March 22, 2017

        “Any new gold source can cause hyper-inflation, like happened to Europe when the Spanish brought all the gold back from South America.”

        Hyperinflation? I think a few percentage points of annual money growth would be considered low in today’s world. Also, unlike commercial bank money creation, new discoveries of silver/gold don’t give rise to the boom/bust cycle, only rising prices. (Other, non-monetary factors were at play, too, notably rising demand for goods and services in a post-Plague Europe of high population growth.)

        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_Price_Revolution

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      • Hipster Racist
        March 22, 2017

        Did you actually read that link about the Spanish price revolution?

        “The specie flow through Spain increased Spanish prices and consequentially spread inflation through Western Europe. This enlarged the money supply and price levels of many European countries. The Spanish Price Revolution is overwhelmingly the most prolonged and influential occurrence of rampant inflation in modern history.”

        “Also, unlike commercial bank money creation, new discoveries of silver/gold don’t give rise to the boom/bust cycle, only rising prices”

        More Austrian theology.

        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Business_cycle

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      • bob saffron
        March 22, 2017

        Sam J:
        “Money supply should be expanded at the same rate the productive economy is expanding.”

        This indeed is what we all endured through school, college etc., but it’s not correct. Money supply is whatever the market determines, when the government is not involved. Given that gold reserves massively dwarf production, money supply under a gold standard would probably increase minimally. As production of goods and services improves and increases, money prices go down. Salaries in nominal terms won’t grow much, but in real terms increase as cost-of-living diminishes.

        By the way, money supply growth in Japan for the last two decades has averaged at less than 2% (despite the authorites’ rhetoric). They’ve avoided much of the misallocations that the Eurozone countries and the US have experienced in this same period.

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      • Hipster Racist
        March 22, 2017

        “Given that gold reserves massively dwarf production, money supply under a gold standard would probably increase minimally. As production of goods and services improves and increases, money prices go down.”

        Limit the supply of money so it’s able to be monopolized by a small group. It’s a classic case of monopoly – exactly why central banks love gold.

        “Money supply is whatever the market determines”

        Well which is it? If money is gold, is it not the market that determines supply at all. Gold is a physical element created by natural processes far outside of the time scale of human beings. The market has virtually zero effect on the supply of physical gold.

        Liked by 1 person

      • bob saffron
        March 23, 2017

        Did I ever advocate for a gold standard? No. I believe gold or silver is historically the money of choice, but don’t believe in any government intervention in the matter. People will decide which is the best currency.

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    • Hipster Racist
      March 21, 2017

      ” Japanese public debt is stratosferic”

      What is that old saying? If you owe $10,000 to the bank, that is your problem.

      If you owe $10 billion dollars to the bank – that is the bank’s problem.

      In 2008 when the derivatives went south, China was on the hook for billions to Goldman Sachs. They had bought derivatives from Goldman on their oil company. The economy crashed and all of a sudden their assets turned to liabilities.

      Goldman came calling and China said – fuck you, we won’t pay – and simply cancelled the contract.

      Liked by 1 person

      • bob saffron
        March 21, 2017

        Whose problem it ends up being is a political consideration, but the problem itself can’t be ignored. Japan’s public debt will have to be either written off or repaid. It’s essentially held by individual Japanese and Japanese institutions

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      • Hipster Racist
        March 21, 2017

        The second half of the post is about the Triffin dilemma. It is one of the main reasons why the Austrian’s predictions have failed 90% of the time since WWII. It was not going off the gold standard that caused the inflation of the 1970s – it was the OPEC strike. Oil > Gold, apparently.

        If Japan owes Japanese currency to itself – so what? It just prints some more. Japan has had nothing but deflation no matter how much currency they print. There goes yet another Austrian prediction right out the window.

        Liked by 1 person

      • bob saffron
        March 21, 2017

        Given that US taxpayers are some 1 trillion dollars lighter for the GFC bank bail-out, it’s clear who the real loser was.

        Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 22, 2017

        The bailouts were clearly a rip off. Yet prices for most things didn’t budge much and it was mostly the big players rejiggering their fake money between themselves – it did NOT have a major monetary impact on the average citizen. The average taxpayer didn’t actually turn out “1 trillion dollars lighter” – because that 1 trillion dollars was just phantom bank money anyway. It was never a part of the real economy, merely accounting entries in the central banks and their member banks.

        They created trillions in money to stop the deflation – but that money never “trickled down” to the actual economy, thus no inflation.

        Can Austrians ever speak to the **distribution** of money as opposed to just the quantity? Because it doesn’t make a god damn bit of difference if there is one trillion in circulation, or two trillion in circulation, if the money just goes from one Wall Street bank account to another and never actually gets spent in the mainstream economy.

        Can Austrians ever actually address the real economy of goods and services?

        Liked by 1 person

      • Sam J.
        March 22, 2017

        ” Japanese public debt is stratosferic”

        The Japanese are much smarter than us. When the Jews try to force them to do something they politely smile and do whatever the fuck they want. They control their banks so they can just write this off as if it never existed at all and merrily go on their way. The debt has no meaning.

        I think part of it is just propaganda. When the Japanese started doing so well it prompted a backlash in the US so the Japanese promptly form that point on constantly played up the poor me, we’re in a stagnate economy line. Their press does what the gov. ask so that’s the line and that’s what you’ll hear. If you look at their economy and then weigh it against their shrinking population and how they are still taking care of their elderly compared to to idiot Americans they’re doing great.

        The Japanese live in a paradise in their cities compared to the average American in our cities where various alien races prey on them and the wealthy shit down their necks constantly.

        Like

      • Sam J.
        March 22, 2017

        “…Goldman came calling and China said – fuck you, we won’t pay – and simply cancelled the contract…”

        HAHA much amusement. Fuck the Jews.

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 22, 2017

        Austrian economics doesn’t offer predictions that aren’t logically defensible. For example, if the money supply increases, then money prices will be higher than they would have been absent the increase. As to which prices increase, which decrease and by how much, that’s just guessing. No one can know with certainty the future aggregate supply/demand for a good or service.

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      • Hipster Racist
        March 22, 2017

        Austrian economics is like math. It can be completely logical based on your starting axioms. Non-euclidean geometry is completely logically defensible – it just doesn’t map to anything interesting in the real world. Austrian economics is like a video game. Video games are logical – there are rules, and if you make the right moves you win points.

        Austrianism is based on praxeology which is an imaginary, fictional, and false model of human behavior. It’s been shown to be false by neurology, specifically, but also by the humanities.

        Austrianism is also based on deceptive language, such as the “money supply.” Define “money supply.” There are 10,000 pounds of gold locked in a vault and two gold coins circulating in the marketplace. The “money supply” is 10,000 pounds plus two ounces of gold. But the only effective money supply is two ounces.

        OK, gold is supposed to be superior because you can’t print it, and governments print money thus cause inflation. But governments can also hoard gold and spend it in the marketplace – thus causing monetary inflation.

        Then of course there is the velocity of money. There are also other forms of money besides gold and fiat.

        Austrianism only “works” and is only “logical” when you ignore 99% of reality and only focus on a tiny, theoretical system.

        Liked by 1 person

      • bob saffron
        March 22, 2017

        “They created trillions in money to stop the deflation – but that money never “trickled down” to the actual economy, thus no inflation.”

        Sure it did. The new money went straight into financial assets. Chart the money supply against the SP500 or NASDAQ or TXY to get the picture. That was always the point. Raise sagging financial asset prices to improve banks’ balance sheets.

        Now, if I were a punting man I’d say the SNAP IPO is probably as good a sign as you get that the Trump bubble is about to pop. We’ll probably start to hear more talk about the debt ceiling just as Treasury’s account with the Fed has been drained to nil.

        https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/WLTGAL

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 22, 2017

        ” It was not going off the gold standard that caused the inflation of the 1970s – it was the OPEC strike”

        And yet the facts reveal a different story. Germany, the oil importer, experienced 7% inflation during the crisis; Saudi Arabia, 35% for the same period. The Bundesbank’s tight rein over money supply was the difference. Oil price-hikes per se are likely to spur recessions and tend to be deflationary.

        http://www.safehaven.com/article/5348/why-rising-oil-prices-will-not-fuel-us-inflation

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      • Sam J.
        March 23, 2017

        “…because that 1 trillion dollars was just phantom bank money anyway. It was never a part of the real economy, merely accounting entries in the central banks and their member banks…”

        I disagree. It was real money. Accounting or not if they had put this accounting in my bank account I would have been very happy.

        I think it quite possible that the whole banking crisis was planned. There’s a CSPAN video where a House of Representatives said money market accounts were withdrawn 550 billion in a matter of hours. Here’s the video. I find this hard to believe that it was all spontaneous.

        The numbers are they were given $16 Trillion(know from Rep. Rand investigation) and some sources using public data say $28 Trillion. I bet, I almost sure what they did was they bought the whole economy with this money. I looked up the price of major stocks and it was somewhere around $15 Trillion so they got the whole damn economy for nothing. I think they got this money at essentially zero interest so they got the whole economy for nothing.

        Let’s look at alternatives. We could have bought the whole damn countries assets(businesses and corporations) and then issued dividends to every American. Instead the banks got it all.

        I think we should use the military to steal all the money back, Remember “letters of Marque”? We should steal all the money from the Jews and shoot the whole lot of them. Take over the FED and work it for the US population.

        Like

    • bob saffron
      March 21, 2017

      Those empty Chinese cities and countless millions of apartments are a monument to Keynesian folly. The capital flight from the yuan speaks to big domestic problems.

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      • Hipster Racist
        March 22, 2017

        “Those empty Chinese cities and countless millions of apartments are a monument to Keynesian folly. ”

        Yet the houses still exist, if the Chinese population grows – guess what? They have just invested in housing.

        How is it different than digging up a bunch of gold that sits inside a bank vault? Keynes would have no problem putting people to work digging gold out of the ground! He said it didn’t matter what you dug out of the ground – as long as people were digging.

        So – the Chinese invested in housing, which people can actually live in. As opposed to gold, which doesn’t make a particularly good shelter.

        Sounds like a smart investment.

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      • Sam J.
        March 22, 2017

        Wacky thought for the day. The Jews actually had a conference on where to move. China or India. I think you could actually download the thing at one time. I think they realized that both would be a problem, The Indians and Chinese don’t give a fuck about the Jews, Hitler or any of that. But before the Jews came to that conclusion what if they built a bunch of cities…for the Jews???? What if they planed to crash the US economy then whisk their way to China with all the loot they got from the US?

        Liked by 1 person

      • bob saffron
        March 22, 2017

        That housing will never be occupied on an economic basis. It was built merely to generate employment and profits for Party cadres’ business associates.

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      • Hipster Racist
        March 22, 2017

        They spent the money on building houses. They could have just paid people to sit at home, the end result would be the same except there wouldn’t be any housing. Sure, it’s a misallocation of labor and some natural resources, but that’s a political issue as much as an economic issue.

        Besides, that entire story was just that – a story. I remember when it made the rounds at places like Zerohedge a while back. Are those houses still empty? Is China’s population still growing?

        Like

  4. bob saffron
    March 21, 2017

    Nat Rothschild certainly got jewed by the Indonesians in his unhappy coal venture. Not even his mother could rescue him from getting rolled.

    Like

  5. icareviews
    March 21, 2017

    Reblogged this on icareviews.

    Like

  6. Sam J.
    March 22, 2017

    “…Fred Hu, managing director of Goldman Sachs Group, said the currency wars were “non-existent”…”

    That guy is a damned liar. They absolutely did this. I know for a fact in Argentina Goldman came into Argentina and opened banks where the Argentinians could keep their dollars in US dollars. After they scooped up all the middle classes cash into these accounts they changed the rules. Then they limited the amount that could be removed and inflated the whole entire middle classes money away. American always talk like the Argentinians are some stupid idiots that ruined their economy. It isn’t true they were murdered. By our banks. Think it can’t happen to you? It might but I think that the Jews have come to the realization that they have no where to go.

    Some have speculated that they realize that they need to prop the US back up and move back manufacturing because the Jews can’t control the Chinese. The Chinese are like them and tell the Jews what they want to hear then rip them off. Couldn’t happen to a better bunch I say.

    I read that one of the best sellers in China is “The Protocols of the Elders of Zion”. They’re not going to let themselves be screwed like us.

    We should tax the FED 10,000%, take over all their assets and print our own money. We should also get out of the business of being the standard trading currency. It may help us a little but long term it’s killing us.

    The new SDR is just another scam. The US dollar is based on debt and any instrument based on debt will eventually go bad. Think about it, if every single dollar you have is based on debt then when all the debt created to pay it off is paid then you have how much money…none because it’s all based on debt. You’re actually in the negative numbers because you owe money that you don’t have. A fine system we have. No matter how hard you work you have…nothing.

    I complain about the gold backed system but at least with it you have something.

    The SDR is just kicking the same debt based system upstairs to the BIS(International bankers). It changes nothing. It will seem as if there’s a reset but it’s just more of the same. It will be worse because they will control the capacity of our currency. Any country that gets out of line will be squeezed.

    For SDR info you really got to read this guy. He’s good.

    https://philosophyofmetrics.com/category/free-pom/

    He used top do all his posting in the open for free but he got such a large readership he decided to make a few bucks off of it. Not that I blame him. Fortunately he left his old stuff public.

    I do believe that the Rothschild or in actuality the Jews control most everything. Not because they are the only owners but because they Jews are the root. They are the nexus of control Without them I think it would be extremely impossible to control anything. There’s plenty of others in on it and I’m sure there’s factions but they’re the ones propping the whole damn thing up.

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    • Hipster Racist
      March 22, 2017

      The Federal Reserve itself is somewhat of a red herring. It’s just a quasi-government bureaucracy meant to protecting the banking industry from democracy.

      The real “conspiracy” as it were is the ability of banks to “create money out of thin air.” It’s all due to a simple accounting trick – somewhere, I have a link to a techie/sciencey/Ted-talkey publication that goes into this. It is of course legal – it is simply the distinction between a “finance” company and a non-finance company. The really big corporations all have finance arms that take advantage of it to. The new tech industry is starting to muscle in on traditional finance and some of the highest IQs are going into tech not Wall Street so there is somewhat of a power struggle.

      Note that the big tech firms are getting into finance – and the big finance firms are getting into tech via Bitcoin and blockchains and the like.

      The problem with the Ron Paul goldbugs is that they are literally stuck in the 1700s, technologically and socially. Gold is such a ridiculous red herring at this point – note that they simply cannot even explain what they see in it except that it is scarce. But bitcoin is far scarcer – and less likely to inflate – then even gold.

      This is how fetishistic gold has become – there were serious discussions about inserting *molecules* of gold into paper notes as a sort of “gold backed currency” after some sort of crash. OK – think of the massive technology and manpower needed to measure molecules of gold – and sew them into paper money – all to put some theoretical limit on money printing.

      The central banks LOVE gold. They know exactly how to manipulate the gold markets, they know that the Saudis and lower races are are still superstitious about gold. So they flood the market with gold, then they buy the gold, then flood the market again. They can manipulate gold just as easily as they can paper and electronic money. They also do the same with silver – I made bank helping crash JP Morgan’s silver short back in the mid 2000s. All the goldbugs got together and forced JP Morgan to let the price rise – then we all sold and made some money. Of course to JP Morgan it just meant they made a tiny bit less profit for one quarter but us internet goldbugs made out great – provided you sold at the right time. If you didn’t – you got stuck with a bunch of useless silver sitting on your shelf tarnishing because Morgan just put the short back on six months later.

      The Austrians are like a fucking cult, I swear. Just read how they argue – it’s a religion, like “presuppositional apologetics.” The Ron Paul types are actually QUITE useful to the Central bankers because they are basically a form of controlled opposition. Most Austrians are “little people” – the lower rich, at most, most very middle class. And they are always taking the side of the Rothschilds by being inflation hawks and demanding “hard money.” I mean, really, talk about useful idiots. They are the monetary equivalent of the progressive leftists who claim to speak for the working class while demanding the mass importation of cheap scab labor.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Sam J.
        March 23, 2017

        I cough, cough, got got screwed on the silver. I wanted to have silver in case of complete monetary collapse as it’s always worth something. but I bought at the top of the market. I’m not getting rid of it because it’s for emergencies but it does tweak my ass every time I look at the price. AHHHHHHH! All I bought was junk silver coins. I don’t have a lot but still.

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  7. bob saffron
    March 22, 2017

    https://mises.org/system/tdf/What%20Has%20Government%20Done%20to%20Our%20Money_3.pdf?file=1&type=document

    All one needs to understand money creation under a fiat money, fractional-reserve banking system.

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  8. bob saffron
    March 22, 2017

    http://www.macrotrends.net/2016/10-year-treasury-bond-rate-yield-chart

    Just a punter’s (non-doctrinaire) opinion: If it turns out that last year’s low of 1.37% for T-Notes was an inflection point, then we’re entering into a very new economic environment. Rising interest rates, rising money supply, falling financial asset prices and rising commodity prices. And Trump – unreasonably – is going to be blamed for the monetary policy legacy of Greenspan, Bernanke and Yellen as well as his administration’s bungles. I think he’ll be lucky to survive one term.

    Like

    • Hipster Racist
      March 22, 2017

      I’ll bet you two silver ounces right now that there will be no major change in the economy in the next year. We’ll still be reading here in a year.

      Just come up with some economic metric and I’ll bet you there will be no major earth shattering changes. No massive deflation or inflation, no riots in the street, no bread lines, etc.

      I ALWAYS win this bet. Austrians and every other ideologue are always predicting the Apocalypse Any Day Now.

      Like

      • bob saffron
        March 22, 2017

        You’re on! The SP500 lower in one year’s time from today. Starting saving your shekels now.

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 23, 2017

        SP500 < 2348 March 22, 2018. Just enough to buy one Cohiba Esplendidos.

        Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 23, 2017

        I said:

        “I’ll bet you two silver ounces right now that there will be no major change in the economy in the next year. We’ll still be reading here in a year.

        Just come up with some economic metric and I’ll bet you there will be no major earth shattering changes. No massive deflation or inflation, no riots in the street, no bread lines, etc.”

        The S&P going down a few percentage points is not at all an “earth shattering change” that will lead to bread lines, massive inflation, or riots in the street. If the S&P goes up or down a little bit, who cares. That is not worth the cost to ship two oz of silver.

        Austrians have been predicting the ATMs will stop working and how we’ll all be toting wheel barrows full of Bernake bucks to the bank because QE3 was going to trigger the hyper-inflation. Every single day since 2008. Still hasn’t happened.

        If all you are willing to predict is that the stock market is going to go up or down a little bit it’s not worth any sort of bet. The point of the silver bet is because in hyperinflation 2oz of silver will be worth a hundred gazillion worthless fiat money Federal Reserve notes according to Austrians.

        Which of course isn’t going to happen so I’m happy to bet thirty five bucks of silver. Because two oz of silver will still be worth about 35 bucks a year from now and I’ll have the enjoyment of pointing it out every day for the next year.

        So come up with your hyper-inflationary collapse scenario and we’ll make a wager on that.

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 23, 2017

        Actually because I’m feeling magnanimous I’m going to sweeten it to SP500 <2200 by March 22, 2017.

        Like

      • Sam J.
        March 23, 2017

        I like to read a couple of Chartist fairly often. Urban Survival and Armstrong. U. S. says that we at a point that it could fall apart this year but if it doesn’t we should have big gains until I think next year when the sky will fall. I think the chartist are right, also the Generations guys. Things move in cycles and I don’t see the people getting any smarter. We keep making the same mistakes over and over. The problem is…timing. Hard as hell to get that right.

        I actually hope their wrong. I read Anonymous Conservative and his r\K theory and he almost salivates for collapse. It would be terrible if we had a 1930’s event. Much suffering. Including myself. A young Man could hang on and survive but I’m not young. I would be screwed. We have all these aliens in the country things could get major nasty. Guys have all this ammunition but if you shoot a thousand rounds at others how long before one of them get lucky with a round fired your way? There’s a possibility of a big Balkans type event.

        Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 23, 2017

        I don’t buy the collapse scenario.

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 23, 2017

        Wow! A ten percent move in the SP a mere bagatelle? OK, what about I bet you that US Industrial Production in one year’s time is lower than the March 2016 figure of 103.4?

        https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/INDPRO

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 23, 2017

        I’m kind of bearish for the precious metals right now. Any weakness in the equity markets will probably see the usual flight to treasuries and USD.

        I think silver is going to retry $14 before I’d be tempted to take a bullish stance. But hyperinflation bullish, nope.

        You’ll have to contact “fans” for their take on the game.

        Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 23, 2017

        No hyperinflation means the entire Austrian issue with all the money printing is moot.

        Can’t make predictions, can’t falsify any of their own theories, have no basis in reality (empiricism.) It’s just religion – a form of Judaism, to be precise.

        Liked by 1 person

      • bob saffron
        March 23, 2017

        @ Sam J.
        Here’s one macro prediction I’m prepared to make. We can see the end of the lowering trend of lower interest rates that started in the early ’80s and I believe will be shown to have ended last year. Now that alone going to play havoc with the Keynesians who run the show as well as with Joe Sixpack and his personal debts and his portfolio/pension plan.

        Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 23, 2017

        “lowering trend of lower interest rates that started in the early ’80s ”

        LOL – all political. Volker jacked up the interest rates to historic highs and therefore – since the central bank hasn’t done that since – it’s a “lowering trend.” Come on. This even goes against your own ideology. These interests rates have NOTHING at all to do with anything close to a free market – you are just guessing what the Fed/politicians will do.

        But you’re dressing up politics in economic language.

        Liked by 1 person

      • Hipster Racist
        March 23, 2017

        “The good thing is that eventually economics will right itself. The bad thing is that many will not survive the painful reformation. This is the greatest monetary experiment in world history, and history is littered with failed paper monies.”

        In other words: nothing lasts forever, so therefore at some point in the future this particular system of paper money will fail. But we can’t actually predict hyperinflation at any time in our lifetimes – even though all of our models suggest that – but we’re willing to predict, say, the dollar will fail at some point between now and two million years in the future.

        Pure squid ink.

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 23, 2017

        My prediction on interest rates has nothing to do with Austrian economics, nor did I say that. It’s a punter’s observation.

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 23, 2017

        @ Sam J.:
        I’m sure we’re not going to get a deflationary, 1930’s style depression. Central bankers have all but promised to print up enough money to avoid that. This punter’s guess is that it’s more likely that financial assets will stagnate in and prices of commodities – historically very cheap in inflation-adjusted terms – go up. Like the seventies, though much, much worse (far more debt now).

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 24, 2017

        Make me a wager in something measurable, not merely descriptive – riots, bread lines, etc.

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 24, 2017

        “But we can’t actually predict hyperinflation at any time in our lifetimes”

        The wager was for ***one year***. But if you’re now changing the parameters, yes, I’m happy to bet we’ll experience hyperinflation in our lifetimes.

        Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 24, 2017

        I didn’t change the parameters. So fine, you can skip the bet this year and make it next year. I’m willing to bet every year that there will be no hyperinflation. Austrians have been predicting hyperinflation since forever – especially since QE3. The internet was full of Austrians talking about how inevitable hyperinflation was and that the great dollar collapse was right around the corner so everyone better be stacking their gold and silver and buying freeze dried food.

        They do it all the time, but their predictions never come true.

        Like

  9. bob saffron
    March 22, 2017

    “The Austrians are like a fucking cult, I swear.”

    That’s probably not an unreasonable conclusion, but the same could be said about WN or indeed any marginalized movement which threatens established interests and the doctrines that underpin them.

    Like

    • Hipster Racist
      March 22, 2017

      No because white nationalism is simply a political opinion, while Austrianism is a political opinion posing as science or truth.

      Austrianism does not really threaten establishments interests at all. The gold standard was – and still is – promoted by plenty of established players. Austrians promote hard money, which is beneficial to the wealthy and detrimental to the poor.

      When Ron Paul impatiently asked Ben Bernake, “don’t you consider gold at all?” Bernake just smirked back, “only how much of it to sell.” I mean, did that not clue people in to how the game is played? A gold standard does not in any way threaten central banks because they are the ones that control the gold market. Austrianism is just a big red herring to distract people from actual economic and monetary reforms that would help the average person.

      http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-01-15/loophole-allows-banks-%E2%80%93-not-other-companies-%E2%80%93-create-money-out-thin-air

      Liked by 1 person

      • bob saffron
        March 23, 2017

        No Austrian economics isn’t a political opinion, it’s a deductive science that may inform political views, or not.

        Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 23, 2017

        It is not in any way science because it rejects empiricism and is merely a deductive discipline, like math.

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 23, 2017

        Paper money is beneficial to the owner of the printing press. Counterfeiters are punished and pursued without clemency.

        Like

    • bob saffron
      March 23, 2017

      That’s right. It’s shares a similar methodolgy to mathematics. Empiricism is for natural sciences, where there exist constants and reproducibility. Human nature is not bound by constants.

      Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 23, 2017

        “Human nature is not bound by constants.”

        More magical and religious thinking. Human nature is bound by constants.

        As I explained already, you can make up all sorts of deductive systems that are internally consistent. That doesn’t mean they map on anything interesting in the real world.

        Austrianism is based on false axioms, therefore even though it can be internally consistent, it’s still false in the existing universe.

        Talmudism and Kaballah can be internally consistent too.

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 23, 2017

        “Human nature is bound by constants.” Which ones?

        Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 24, 2017

        Biology.

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 23, 2017

        Which axioms of Austrianism are false?

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 24, 2017

        Don’t know enough about Talmudism or Kabbalism to comment. Sorry.

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 24, 2017

        By “nature” I’m talking about volition, not, obviously, physiology. We understand that man has a body as well as a mind, and that there exist bodily needs that the mind processes..

        Sure, you get hungry and it’s predictable that’ll you’ll eat at some stage. What is unknowable is what you’ll put on your sandwich, etc. Maybe you don’t even know till you open the fridge door.

        Like

  10. Hipster Racist
    March 22, 2017

    The comment section of the Zerohedge article is really good, as people with varying amounts of economic understanding and very different social/political opinions debate the nature of money, currency, and industry.

    We don’t have a fixed supply of goods and services – why should there be a fixed supply of money?

    In a true free market, there would be various competing forms of money. We see, in US history, in fact, the suppression of silver, in favor of gold, precisely BECAUSE silver was a competitor to gold and there was more silver and it could not be as easily monopolized as gold. We saw all sorts of tricks to try to tie the price of silver to gold – many of these were in fact based on odd superstitions and some just guess work.

    Usurers (in Europe, traditionally Jews) loved a gold standard because their network knew how much gold was in the system. They could lend out money, demand repayment in gold, restrict the supply of gold in the market, then confiscate assets when the borrowers defaulted.

    Money, whether gold, silver, paper or electronic, is not wealth (except in cases where gold and silver are used in jewellery, household wares and other items), it is what is used for commerce and makes wealth creation/acquisition possible. Wealth is what enriches one’s life when holding it, using it or consuming it, not when disposing it off. The problem with most gold bugs is that they cannot differentiate between money’s role as enabling commerce and the role of money, now defunct, in preserving purchasing power long into the future. All societies have realised that the supply of money needed for enabling commerce must be elastic for them to take advantage of the industrial age. This means it cannot be tied to the supply of anything that is not elastic. Income that doesn’t need to be used immediately (only a small percentage for most people) can be used to acquire items that are likely to hold their value over long time. There is no reason why the entire money supply should be constrained by the need of a small percentage of it.

    It will be interesting to see what happens when the Bitcoin supply stops growing. This even has the potential to prove these various theories true or false. Bitcoin has a fixed limit – but it is also completely divisible. In theory it will be similar sewing molecules of gold into paper bills.

    Most transactions will be in satoschi, fractions of bitcoins. Someone holding 1000 bitcoins will be Bill Gates

    … except … there are already a dozen variations of crypto-currencies. Hoard Bitcoin all you want – there is Namecoin, Dogecoin, Litecoin, Ethereum …

    If the Bitcoin Bill Gates hoard their Bitcoins – what is to prevent everyone else from simply using an alternative? If the Bitcoin Bill Gates loan out Bitcoin and their borrowers default – what can they do? They can confiscate the collateral. OK, what is the collateral? It’s either real estate or consumer goods… They aren’t making any more real estate.

    So it all comes back to the real economy of goods and services.

    Hoard all the gold you want – people will use silver. Hoard the silver and gold – they will use 2 liter bottles of coke. Why assume that currency is supposed to be a store of value? Real estate is a store of value … except …

    What did Henry George say about real estate? What is the actual value of real estate?

    Liked by 1 person

    • bob saffron
      March 23, 2017

      “Usury” is a meaningless, arbitrary term, unless you’re against all lending at interest. Interest is the cost of time.

      Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 23, 2017

        ““Usury” is a meaningless, arbitrary term, unless you’re against all lending at interest. Interest is the cost of time.”

        The same goes for half of Austrian jargon.

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 23, 2017

        OK, then you give me the interest rate that you call “usury” and explain why that particular rate is bad, but one percent less is legitimate.

        Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 23, 2017

        What the medieval people called “usury” we now understand as “economic rent” not necessarily interest.

        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_rent

        ” In classical economics, economic rent is any payment made (including imputed value) or benefit received for non-produced inputs such as location (land) and for assets formed by creating official privilege over natural opportunities (e.g., patents). In neoclassical economics, economic rent also includes income gained by beneficiaries of other contrived exclusivity, such as labor guilds and unofficial corruption.”

        Money-lending in the medieval era was a privilege granted by the “state” – it was an unearned privilege – and the money lenders did not produce the inputs. They added no value.

        “Economic rent should not be confused with producer surplus, or normal profit, both of which involve productive human action. Economic rent is also independent of opportunity cost, unlike economic profit, where opportunity cost is an essential component.”

        Liked by 1 person

      • bob saffron
        March 23, 2017

        So what’s the rate right now?

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 23, 2017

        Money lending of course produces value. Otherwise parties would never freely contract to borrow/lend. It’s ex ante beneficial to both.

        Like

    • bob saffron
      March 23, 2017

      Bimetallic monetary standards are only rortable when the government sets the exchange rate between the two metals. If there is no fixed rate, Gresham’s Law doesn’t apply.

      Like

    • bob saffron
      March 23, 2017

      Real estate isn’t fungible, divisible or portable, so it’s never going to be a money.

      Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 23, 2017

        No one suggested real estate was “money” or even “currency.” It’s wealth.

        But when someone defaults on a gold loan, the collateral is often real estate, which was the point.

        Gold has only three uses:

        1. Pretty jewelry to put on your wife.

        2. Money/currency in low trust environments.

        3. Allowing the central banks to soak up the excess wealth of Ron Paul fans.

        Liked by 1 person

      • Sam J.
        March 24, 2017

        “…Real estate isn’t fungible, divisible or portable, so it’s never going to be a money…”

        HA. Wrong. 🙂 The State of Pennsylvania issued money based on the value of land. Benjamin Franklin wrote about it. Unfortunately he told the British how wonderful it was, who promptly banned it, Jews you know, and caused a huge collapse. Possible it had ramifications leading to the revolution.

        Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 25, 2017

        Austrians say that “gold is money” therefore any money must have all of the properties of gold in order to be “money.” Well, nothing is exactly like gold, therefore only gold is money. It’s just a circular definition, as is most Austrian ideology.

        Frankly I think Austrianism is a sort of “controlled opposition” to the central banks. Whenever the central banks want to inflate, the Austrians will start screaming about hyperinflation, and they will suggest everyone buys gold. The central bank sells gold to the Austrians which drains liquidity out of the system, thus preventing hyperinflation. Then they just raise gold prices enough to shake out the small holders, rinse and repeat. That is why Bernake just laughed at Ron Paul when Paul asked about gold. Sure, Bernake says, we think about how much gold to sell to suckers like your fans.

        There are all sorts of alternative monetary and financial arrangement that would help the average American, Georgism, currency boards, local currencies. But we’re always stuck with only one “alternative” – Austrianism – which the is “alternative” that the wealthy and those who own the gold want. So the Austrian cult does an amazing job of putting the middle classes and the poor on the side of the central bank, because their “cure” is worse than the disease.

        Remember, it’s perfectly legal to buy and sell gold now. So, in a sense, the Austrians already have what they want. Despite all the libertarian talking points, what they are really upset about is that gold doesn’t have a monopoly. The gimmick they sell to the public is that one day gold will be worth a million dollars and oz so all the Ron Paul fans who have some gold will be instant millionaires and the rich Goldman Sachs bankers will be forced to mow their lawns.

        It’s a religion, not particularly different than the Rapture or Jewish fantasies that the “goyims” will one day be their slaves.

        Liked by 1 person

    • bob saffron
      March 23, 2017

      Aside from central bank stores (I’m staring at you, Fort Knox) no one knows where the gold is hoarded and by whom. That’s the whole point.

      Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 23, 2017

        “no one knows where the gold is hoarded and by whom.”

        No one? Really?

        “That’s the whole point.”

        But why?

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 23, 2017

        People have always hidden gold to fear of predatory taxation or outright expropriation by the authorities.

        Like

    • bob saffron
      March 23, 2017

      Real goods and services depend are transacted in a money not barter economy. The currency’s stability affects all transactions.

      Like

  11. Hipster Racist
    March 22, 2017

    “The new money went straight into financial assets.”

    That is the point. 95% of the population doesn’t have any financial assets other than retirement accounts. Tarp was nothing but a big red herring anyway – that was paid back. The real monetary expansion was Maiden Lane I, II, and III – and 4 I think.

    All that quantitative easing did was inflate the financial assets of the central banks and the major financial companies. That money never “trickled down” to the average worker or small business at all. All they did was to create a bunch of money to stop the deflation of the financial assets. It was little more than an accounting trick.

    The Austrians have been saying that hyper-inflation was coming – ANY DAY NOW – since 2008, every day, all day. It didn’t happen, because Austrianism has very little bearing on the real world. In fact, the Austrians have been screaming HYPERINFLATIONDOLLARCOLLAPSE every day, all day, since the 1930s.

    The Central Banks, all the major financial companies, all the Fortune 500 businesses, all the major global corporations – NONE of them subscribe to Austrian theory. NONE of them model their businesses on Austrian theory.

    The ONLY people who pay any attention to Austrian theory are:

    1. Ron Paul.

    2. People who sell gold coins to Ron Paul fans.

    It’s a cult.

    Liked by 1 person

    • bob saffron
      March 23, 2017

      I don’t know any serious Austrian scholars who said hyper-inflation is on the doorstep.

      New money flows where returns are deemed most attractive. Of course the average Joe didn’t benefit from the financial asset bubble; inflation never benefits the little guy. It’s for the trader class, banks and governments.

      Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 23, 2017

        “I don’t know any serious Austrian scholars who said hyper-inflation is on the doorstep. ”

        Of course the “serious Austrian scholars” never make any predictions that can be checked or any theories that are falsifiable. Because it’s basically a religious doctrine.

        Nevertheless virtually all Austrian fans have been predicting hyperinflation every single day since the 1930s and twice a day since the 2008 collapse.

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 23, 2017

        As you confirm, no serious Austrian scholar has been predicting hyperinflation in the developed world in the near term. What they will say is that prices are higher than they otherwise would be had the quantity of money not increased. Incontrovertible, I’d suggest.

        If the present central bank m.o. continues, at some point it is likely prices will rise for non-financial assets too.

        Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 23, 2017

        >Incontrovertible

        Unfalsifiable, in other words. Hence, not science. And if they can’t make predictions, what is the point? And if the historically massive money creation isn’t going to cause hyperinflation, what’s the problem?

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 23, 2017

        You don’t have to prove empirically 2 + 2 = 4.

        Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 24, 2017

        2 + 2 = 4 is simply a matter of definition. Define the symbol “2” to mean “1 + 1 + 1” and guess what, 2 + 2 = 6.

        So that doesn’t tell us anything useful – just like Austrianism doesn’t tell us anything useful.

        Liked by 1 person

      • bob saffron
        March 23, 2017

        We know that over a century the dollar has lost almost all of its purchasing power, which is consistent with a vast increase in money supply. That’s a useful fact. What can’t be predicted is where punters are going to put their money to preserve purchasing power.

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 23, 2017

        We also know that early receivers of newly-created money enjoy greater purchasing power than late-receivers. So we can understand the swindle. That’s useful, too.

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 26, 2017

        Of course 2 + 2 = 4 tells you something useful, regardless of the symbols used. To have to test this relationship empirically doesn’t make sense.

        What, by contrast, doesn’t make sense is to mathematize non-empirically testable relationships. The love for my first girlfriend was 93% of the love for my second, etc. Human emotions are not quantifiable, pace the neoclassicists.

        Like

    • bob saffron
      March 23, 2017

      Central banks of course are contrary to any philosophy that advocates for their abolition.

      Like

  12. bob saffron
    March 23, 2017
  13. bob saffron
    March 23, 2017

    And governments, without a ready buyer for their bonds in the banks, would be constrained in spending decisions. Not big Austrian supporters, either.

    Like

  14. bob saffron
    March 24, 2017

    “I don’t buy the collapse scenario.”
    – So you’ve got some unspecified neutral or positive numeric value to assign to some economic metric.

    “It is not in any way science because it rejects empiricism”
    – Fine, so transform the nebulous “No collapse” into some hard, verifiable claim. “Bread lines” or “riots in the street” don’t count as scientific terms. At best they are rubbery descriptions.

    “I ALWAYS win this bet.”
    – Which bet? I can’t see any parameters that are in any way verifiable. Remember, you’re the empiricist. You should be able to come up with a projection and be able to justify it scientifically.

    Like

    • Hipster Racist
      March 25, 2017

      Sure, hyperinflation can be given a numeric value. We’ve had massive monetary printing in the last decade. According to Austrians, bread should be $50 a loaf. Austrians were talking about gold at $10,000 an ounce. None of those predictions came even close.

      The stock market can go up or down. The US dollar can go up and down compared to the Euro or the Yuan. But there’s nothing even close to a “collapse” scenario on the horizon.

      If you aren’t willing to bet on any sort of major dislocation other than the S&P going up or down a few percentage point, well, I agree with you. I wouldn’t take that bet either.

      Like

      • bob saffron
        March 25, 2017

        Names of these Austrians, please.

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 25, 2017

        Well I offered you a wager on industrial production, too.

        Like

      • bob saffron
        March 25, 2017

        I don’t see any projections on your part, empiricism notwithstanding.

        Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 27, 2017

        My projection is no hyperinflation and mostly the status quo. A recession? Surely at least one during Trump’s administration. A depression? I doubt it.

        Like

  15. Sam J.
    March 24, 2017

    “I don’t buy the collapse scenario.”

    I really, really, really, really hope you’re right. This country couldn’t handle a collapse like the depression. We’re just not built like we used to be. We would come completely unglued.

    I believe that if we had another all out depression there would be fighting in the street.

    Like

    • Hipster Racist
      March 25, 2017

      During the supposed JP Morgan silver short, I had no real way of knowing if JP Morgan was really shorting silver or if they had a long behind it. I’m just some dude. But what I DID know is that the Austrians were screaming out the JP Morgan short and telling everyone to buy silver – which it was obvious a lot of people were. I could see that since lots of people were going to buy silver because they BELIEVED that they could break the supposed JP Morgan short, chances are that silver prices would go up because there was more demand.

      OK, but then when prices stopped going up, all the silver sellers were saying, don’t worry, silver has gone up from 5 to 20, but trust us it will go up even more! Don’t sell now, silver is sure to reach $100, maybe even $1000! It’s still historically underpriced compared to gold. The ancient peoples said that gold and silver should be at this ratio, etc.

      When I read that, I knew it was time to sell. I literally sold at almost the exact top of the market. I like to think I helped bust the JP Morgan silver short, and maybe I did, but chances are I just did what Warren Buffett said – when people are scared, you buy, when people are greedy, you sell.

      Like

      • Sam J.
        March 26, 2017

        You’re a lot smarter than me I bought at almost the top. I can’t say it was necessarily shills that got me to buy. Maybe subconsciously. It was more of a sense that the whole thing was coming off the rails. I must admit I’m amazed the American economy hasn’t completely imploded. All the movement of manufacturing offshore, the debt, mass immigration of a lot of people who don’t really add much of anything to the economy and a million other lashes against it and it’s still rolling. It’s quite remarkable. Mostly I bought silver as a solar flare, meltdown, mass panic, last resort cash fund. I don’t have much. Probably a laughable amount by your standards but it hurts to have it go down so much. In the long run I’m not really losing anything as it still functions as a last resort cash in hand source in case of panic.

        Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 27, 2017

        @Sam J.

        “the debt” – the debt is in dollars. Dollars are made on a computer now. They are basically internet points. The whole point of linking the Triffin paradox article was hopefully to spur some discussion on this massive subsidy the rest of the world gives to the US via the reserve currency status. It’s similar to the network effect – Facebook was a pretty shitty website to post selfies, but once people contributed to the network effect – in other words, once people collectively decided to give a massive amount of value to Zuckerberg for free – it became one of the most powerful internet companies in the world.

        Economics is dead simple, it’s really the social coordination issues that are hard to solve.

        I wasn’t in any way “smart” – I just realized that lots of people were going to buy silver in a panic.

        But if you want my advice – I’d get rid of all that junk silver ASAP – if there really was some sort of social collapse it would be less than worthless. Sell now while there are still functioning coin shops who will find a bigger sucker.

        If you are really worried about social collapse and hyperinflation – just buy gold krugerrands. That’s a decent way of storing value over time and they are plenty liquid. Silver is too cheap to be worth it. You’d be better off hoarding $50 dollar bills in an envelope under the sink than messing around with silver coins of any kind. But in a hyperinflation scenarios krugerrands will likely hold their value very well and they are the most popular gold coin in the world. You could go to any city on earth and every jeweler, banker, trader, watchmaker, nusimatic would all know what a krugerrand is, how much they are worth, and would likely trade for them.

        Liked by 1 person

      • Sam J.
        March 28, 2017

        “…“the debt” – the debt is in dollars. Dollars are made on a computer now. They are basically internet points…”

        I agree but at the same time disagree. Sure we can cancel the debt but a large amount of it, about half, is owed to someone. To cancel it is to not pay your debt. I understand the bigger picture but at the personal level if the US gov. says, we’re not paying the debt. it will freak people out. That’s one reason I liked Scott Smith for president links that I’ve linked several times. He would cancel the internal FED debt and monetize the rest over five years. After all it cost us interest. They want to keep paper dollars instead of bonds, ok, they want to spend them, ok. Now this would cause inflation but it wouldn’t be forever and it would also help our trade. It’s a full tilt Alt-reality currency play. The dollar would be worth what people pay for it. I believe it would cause a lot of jitters but eventually the dollar is worth what the US is and that’s a lot. Even in our decrepit state we have a lot of stuff.

        Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 28, 2017

        I’m not suggesting that anyone cancel the debt, I’m just saying that the US can simply create – and destroy – dollars as needed. It’s all an accounting entry anyway.

        Of course, there is inflation, and there is deflation. All the politicians, including Trump, are lying about the trade deficit. The US trade deficit means that other countries are giving us real goods and services in exchange for internet points. That is because we have the world’s reserve currency. When the Arabs tried to cash in their dollars to buy the ports, the Democrats just said “no way.” So we sold them some airplanes instead. We can never reduce the trade deficit as long as the dollar is the reserve currency – hence, the Triffin dilemma.

        Of course if the US just printed up a couple of billions of trillion new dollars it would cause inflation. But if we don’t print up enough it will cause deflation. The “debt” is actually a social construct. If we were to stop immigration, we’d frankly have to rejigger the accounting anyway because of the population decrease.

        There is the real economy of goods and services, and then there are claims on the real economy, and that is now internet points. We live in a time of serious overabundance – I’ve read that Iowa alone could feed the world enough corn (no idea if that is literally true.) There is plenty of land. There is still plenty of oil and other natural resources, and technology just keeps getting better.

        Quite a lot of what we put a price on is frankly economic rent as well – copyright on movies, various types of patents. Think about how much labor is just wasted in worthless pursuits anyway – think of advertising.

        The basic needs of the US population can be supplied with far fewer resources and labor than we use now.

        Where it gets tricky are things that have an inelastic demand curve – like medicine, or beautiful women, or the number one spot on google.com.

        Economics is easy, it’s social coordination that is the hard problem to solve.

        Liked by 1 person

      • Sam J.
        March 28, 2017

        Forgot, the silver, no I’m keeping that. It’s panic money. It’s not a lot at all. I would be embarrassed to, tell you how little. I also keep some cash about, and food. If there’s ever trouble then I don’t want to be one of those dupes out trying to get money from the bank or food from an empty supermarket while the Groids murder everyone.

        Like in New Orleans. I’ve got probably enough food for 6 months, very poor fair for a lot of it, but rice and beans taste great when you’re starving.

        Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 28, 2017

        I understand it’s panic money – but what I am saying is that junk silver is a terrible form of panic money. No one will trade for silver dimes unless there are functioning coin shops. There are far better forms of panic money – like krugerrands. And if things really go to shit, ammo.

        Like

    • bob saffron
      March 25, 2017

      @ Sam J.:
      Count me in as one of the (inflationary) depression-mongers. That said, at present the drivers for bull markets in precious metals just aren’t there. Rising real interest rates are bearish for pm’s. Real interest rates fell from Nov. ’08 to Nov. ’12 (ie. rising TIPS price).
      https://tinyurl.com/msoubza

      Compare the action in TIPS with the gold and you’ll see that since 2013 the real interest rate has been rising or flat, not a good setting for a bull market in gold. The yield curve has been flattening too, not good for pm’s.
      http://goldprice.org/gold-price-chart.html

      Like

  16. NikoBellic
    March 25, 2017

    @Hipster Racist

    I really like what I’m reading here, both the articles and in the comment section. I would like to suggest a subject I’m sure you and the other guys know a lot about. I’m always hearing some mishmash about the Rockefellers and whatnot, what I would like to hear is their influence on US and (thus) global politics both now, and this past half of the 20th century. With David Rockefellers passing, a lot of people are actually focusing their attention on him and the family in general but there aren’t many people shooting out sharp, cold facts out for us to get to know. Thanks in advance, I will be eagerly waiting for an article that covers this subject.

    https://www.thenewamerican.com/culture/biography/item/25654-david-rockefeller-mr-globalist-dead-at-101

    Also, is this of any use?

    Like

    • Hipster Racist
      March 25, 2017

      @NikoBellic

      See Carroll Quigley’s infamous “Tragedy and Hope.”

      Like

      • Sam J.
        March 25, 2017

        I have this book and have started reading it probably 20 times. It has some super interesting passages but a lot of it is dense mind numbing minutiae that bores me to death. I’m a serious book worm and it’s difficult for even me to read. This is coming from someone who read all the volumes of “Story of Civilization” by Will and Ariel Durant. The problem is start on it then set it down. When I pick it up again it’s usually been so long ago I just start over. I must seriously force myself to read it some day. I guess I could get through it in a week if I stayed at it.

        Like

      • NikoBellic
        March 25, 2017

        Will do, thank you. Quigley is well known and recognized despite digging into some good info on the elite and their plans for the world, which is surprising seeing how the media and the entertainment industry is quick to label everyone a batshit conspiracy theorist. Different times I guess. He often mentions the Anglo-American elite, which is today well known to anyone whos not totally apolitical, but I wonder where do the Jews factor in all this with the Rockefellers and all? There is a common yet understandable misconception that the Rockefellers are Jewish considering the fact that most globalists today are I can see this as a possible reason, and also having David Rockefellers ugly rat look too lol. But despite this it is no secret that they have connections to all the top Jews, namely David is connected to Kissinger, Rothschild both of which go waaay back with him and also new money such as Soros and such. Whats your take on all this? Can you, or anyone here give a ‘quick rundown™’ on this?

        Also, please feel free to recommend me any more interesting literature. Thanks.

        Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 27, 2017

        You have to skim the first half of the book, at least all the way until WWI, unless you have six months to essentially take a college course in Human Civilization.

        Like

    • Sam J.
      March 25, 2017

      I wonder how Rockefeller got all his money. He wasn’t necessarily anyone special. I read one time that his real ace in the hole to wealth was a patent he had. He invented or owned the railroad tanker car. If true this would make a great deal of sense as oil was carried in barrels. Yes ordinary wood barrels before the tanker car. This would also account for his greatly reduced rates for transporting oil. How could anyone compete if you’re making barrels and put oil in it. You couldn’t. If this is true then it shows what a huge difference a small improvement makes. It wasn’t real small but the gains compared to the advantage were WAY high. He monopolized most of the oil business.

      Like

    • Sam J.
      March 28, 2017

      Here’s a kick ass reading list on big ideas, I always love those.

      The Pursuit of Power: Technology, Armed Force, and Society since A.D. 1000 by William H. McNeill

      Plagues and Peoples by William H. McNeill

      The Rise and Fall of the Great Powers by Paul M. Kennedy

      This is a series of books I read that had a powerful effect on me by James Dale Davidson and Sir William Rees-Mogg. They are based on the idea of Metapolitics. Namely that power and politics are based on the Technology of defense and offense. Mao, “Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun.” An example; gunpowder brought about the rise of large states due to cost of cannon. It also destroyed castles which collapsed smaller states. It lowered the power of defense. Followed by “the Right of Kings”. The main idea being until the technology supported it “the Right of Kings” was just so much nonsense. The authors claim the microprocessor is decreasing the power of offense which decreases the power of large States. During the World Wars you needed a large population with lots of guns to prevail. Now a small group armed with advanced weapons can attack at will hitting their targets every time. From this they concluded the welfare state and the USA was doomed. The books are also investment books. They did not do so well on this because they were just too soon. Who knew the US could stay afloat in such dire circumstances. They’re well worth reading. I’m like probably most of the people here, a book worm, and these are some of the best books I’ve read ever on BIG ideas with far reaching ideas. The books are old so most only cost a penny plus shipping.

      “Blood in the Streets: Investment Profits in a World Gone Mad” (1987)
      The Great Reckoning: How the World Will Change in the Depression of the 1990’s (1994)
      The Sovereign Individual: Mastering the Transition to the Information Age (1999)

      Another good book “The Squeeze” by James Dale Davidson (1980) that is good. From a long time ago talking about how we got into this shape.

      For Good and Evil: The Impact of Taxes on the Course of Civilization by Charles Adams

      Debt: The First 5, 000 Years by David Graeber. I think you can find a free copy online.

      The 48 Laws of Power – Robert Greene

      All of these are excellent. Most can be obtained through the library or cheap on Amazon. You can find pdf’s of some online also.

      Like

      • Sam J.
        March 28, 2017

        Arrrgh! I forgot one of the most important ones. It’s very small. A powerpoint.

        “Dennis M. Bushnell, Future Strategic Issues/Future Warfare [Circa 2025] ” he goes over the trends of technology coming up and how they may play out. His report is not some wild eyed fanaticism it’s based on reasonable trends. Link.

        https://archive.org/details/FutureStrategicIssuesFutureWarfareCirca2025

        Page 70 gives the computing power trend and around 2025 we get human level computation for $1000. The only way that this can have no meaning is if computers go crazy with human or higher than human level computation. This idea comes from Larry Niven, Pournelle, etc. great Sci-Fi writers in the grand space opera tradition. I just don’t believe it. Every since this computer trend has been established Sci-fi has had a hard time dealing with it. Greg Egan has a great series “culture series” where the computers become partners with us but we have no assurance that this is the case.

        The real problem is not that the machine is smart it’s that it has no empathy for humans. How does empathy work? I don’t think anyone knows. It’s hard enough to program intelligence. We know people with no empathy cause all sorts of problems. What about psychopathic super machines. It’s frightening.

        I see three futures that are coming very fast. They will probably be set within 15 to 20 years. One is where the robots do all the manual labor for us. Grow our food, all the dirty work and we will take it easy with plenty for all. Along with this could be nuclear power, especially molten salt reactors, which can easily provide all the needed energy for the whole planet at very high rates. With enough energy city farming could leave lots of room for nature. Might be too boring for some but it’s better than number two.
        Number two the wealthy and psychopaths control the robots and kill everyone off not “in the club”. I have no doubt, although it would take several pages of lengths of links to begin to prove it, that psychopaths are in very large numbers controlling many positions in our government and corporations. Even worse, they being psychopaths, they would after killing all the normal people move quickly to killing each other off. There would be very few or no people left. Maybe even nothing but robots like in the Berserker War series of science fiction that have no function but to end life.
        The third is not much better. We get the AI’s but something goes wrong. Say a corn growing AI in Iowa notices all the areas it’s not growing corn. Somehow comes to the conclusion that the humans are screwing up it’s ability to maximize corn production. Makes a virus to kill all humans and proceeds to cover the Earth with corn. The AI after doing so is deliriously happy.

        The reason why people fear the future is it’s really scary. Look at all the bugs and viruses in a simple personal computer and think about what the odds are something will be detrimental in an AI’s programming.

        Like

      • Hipster Racist
        March 28, 2017

        Robotics is already here. I can buy one of those 3d printers for like 500 bucks at the computer store. Machine learning, a type of AI, is here – I play around with that for fun although I am just a beginner, less than an amateur really.

        Another reason we are simply going to have to do something about the low level job market.

        I will say the libertarians have one thing right – we need to get rid of the minimum wage and make it easier for richer people to hire poorer people as help. Right now people just skirt the laws – part of the reason we have an illegal alien problem – no one wants to go through the legal hassle and risk of hiring someone to mow the lawn – it costs as much to comply and pay SS taxes and the like as it does in labor. So people just find a no-tell esse at the Home Depot. Both Richard Spencer and MW have pointed out that that sort of thing is really great for white teenagers.

        Honestly if we had a White Republic even libertarianism would mostly work fine.

        If the USA would just stop all immigration now, expel all the illegals, “encourage” a lot of people to leave one way or another (maybe we should just take over Mexico and deport anyone we don’t want to there and run it mostly hands-off) – once the baby boomers die off we’d have a huge country with enough resources and technology to be completely self-sufficient and a much smaller population.

        People that really contribute – like doctors – would be the new elites and wealthy. Everyone else can contribute what they can and live well.

        But we’ll never get there if we keep importing our replacements and growing the population.

        Like

      • NikoBellic
        March 29, 2017

        Thanks a lot for the list, I will make sure to save it all so I can read it when I can! Honestly am looking forward to it.

        Again, thank you Sammy 🙂

        Like

  17. parallelplace
    May 1, 2017

    “Yet purchasing power is is “transferred” by various other means as well. If you make up a gold shaped problem, obviously gold is the solution. It’s a solution in search of a problem.” Explain this to me Hipster. I’m not a gold bug, but the pp transfer objection is one I’m hard pressed to rebut. Also could you detail the various other means pp is transferred under gold? Thanks.

    Like

    • Hipster Racist
      May 2, 2017

      There was nothing particularly significant to that comment. “Purchasing power” is just another way to say the ability to transfer value or wealth, and the term is typically used in relation to inflation and deflation.

      Austrians believe that all money exists in one big pool but that is not the case. You lose “purchasing power” when prices for what you are purchasing goes up. You gain purchasing power when prices go down.

      Like

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